"The Christianity of history is not Protestantism. If ever there were a safe truth it is this, and Protestantism has ever felt it so; to be deep in history is to cease to be a Protestant." (-John Henry Newman, An Essay on the Development of Christian Doctrine).

"Where the bishop is, there let the people gather; just as where ever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church". -St. Ignatius of Antioch (ca 110 AD)a martyr later thrown to the lions, wrote to a church in Asia Minor. Antioch was also where the term "Christian" was first used.

“But if I should be delayed, you should know how to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of truth.” 1 Timothy 3:15

"This is the sole Church of Christ, which in the Creed we profess to be one, holy, catholic and apostolic." -CCC 811

Thursday, March 8, 2012

Jesse Romero (Catholic) vs Jose Ventilacion (INC) Debate

37 comments:

  1. pnalo si Brother Jesse Romero

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  2. It's not because I am also a Catholic but I can see that Mr. Jose Ventilacion's arguments couldn't really stand up against Mr. Jesse Romero's rhetorics. I am a Filipino and I'm glad to be a Catholic! May God bless you more Mr. Romero in your evangelistic zeal through the guidance of the Holy Spirit!

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  3. Naipit na ayaw p rin aminin ni mr romero wala.p rin makakatalo sa debate s inc. Catholic pilosopo lng walang mabasa sa bibliya.. e ung pagsamba sa diyos diyosan ay labag sa mata ng diyos pero kung kay romero hindi! dami maling aral ng katoliko that why i leave the catholic. And now im iglesia ni cristo. The true church,one god and one saviour and mediator jesus christ. yan ang nsa bible wag nyo mg baguhin at dagdagan bawal sa bible yan.

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    Replies
    1. Kahit sinasabi na ng MEDI na "FELIX FOUNDED THE INC" pero ayaw nio pa ring tanggapin.

      Kahit sinabi na ng NSO na 2-4 million lang kayo pero ayaw niyo pa rin aminin at sinasabi niyo pa rin na 10 milliyon kayo.

      Eh kahit na sabihin natin panalo si Romero over kay Ventilacion sa Acts 20:28 pero para sa inyo panalo si Ventilacion eh ganon talaga ang lalabas sa bunganga niyo...

      Pero CHALLENGE namin.. magpakita nga kayo ng katibayan na si "Cristo ang nagtatag ng INC" at kayo ay 10 million at si VEntilacion ang nanalo?

      Eh hanggang ngayon eh wala man lang blog, o website, o twitter, o facebook account si Ventilacion... Pero ang Catholic Answers eh MERON SILANG OFFICIAL SOCIAL NETWORK ACCOUNTS....

      Kaawaaan kayo ng Dios sa panlilinlang niyo.

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    2. Tama ka kapatid marami nga ang Katoliko,sobrang dami nyo kasi sabi sa Biblia maraming malilipol sa araw ng paghuhukom kasindami ng buhangin sa dagat...marami kayong katoloko diba, kayo na yun kasama sa malilipol.Pag isipan mo nga muna ang mga sagot mo bago mo ipublish.

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    3. “We honor sacred images in order to show our veneration for the person the represent, not to adore them as gods.” (My Catholic Faith, Page 191)
      “We do not pray to the crucifix, to the images and relics of the saint but to the person they represent” (Catholic Catechism, Number 565)

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    4. Thanks Jennifer Acha.. God bless.

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    5. hahaha loko loko kaba Anonymous hahaha yung mga tanong ng Ventelacion mo mga pambata kesho me makikita ba sa Bibliya na Ganito? ano ginawa ni Bro. Romero di ba sinagot niya ng matino at take Note Logically!!!! eh yang BENTELADOR mo! ano tinanong ni Bro. ROMERO na kung asan ba ang pangalan ni Felix Manalo o kahit pa anak at apo niya saan mababasa sa Bibliya na sakanila ibinigay ng Diyos ang SUSI! ano sagot ng BENETADOR mo! WALA!!!!! SABI NIYA PA PARANG BADING "THAT's A SILLY QUESTION!!! KAININ MO YAN sarili nyong tactics bumubuag sa katangahan nyo!!!!!!!!!!!

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    6. anong ayaw aminin? haha kita mong sinasagot ng maayos eh take note it is in a very Logical sense hahaha natawa lng ako sa mga palpak na sagot ni Ventelacion hahaha di makasagot ng tama hahaha tinanong ni Bro Romero Saan sa Bible makikita ang pangalan ni Felix Manalo at mga Descendants neto? saan makikita na sakanila ibinigay ang Susi. hahaha sagot ni Ventelacion: That's a Silly QUESTION! hahaha ang talino mo pre pag ikaw makatanong ng mga walang kwentang tanong kala mo ang talino mo nung ikaw na ang pinapasagot that's a silly question ang sasabihin mo XD hahahahaha

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    7. Salamat po Cololo Colonel.

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  4. Don't be one sided open your mind and accept the true doctrines and true church. Theres a lot of religion today but the iglesia ni cristo is very unique. its doctrines are all based in the bible not in the opinion of man. Open your heart if you want the salvation of you soul you have to accept the true church which is INC. Many of us leave the catholic church. Thanks god he call us and sent us in the true faith.

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    Replies
    1. Kami pa ang one sided ngayon eh.. sa kabila ng katotohanang LANTAD sa internet ang aming KATEKISMO, HISTORY, STATISTICS and official printouts pero kayo YOU DONT QUOTE from THESE OFFICIAL DOCUMENTS...

      Samantalang kapag kinwot namin ang official magazine niyo eh sasabihin niyong minanali namin ang pakahulugan nito o kaya wala raw pasugong ganyan... pero di man lang kayo makapagpakita ng katunayan na WALA NGA ito sa pasugo?

      Puro kayo ngalngal kulang sa gawa... madaling magparatang mahirap patunayan!

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    2. Ang Bible ang nagsasalita sa mga maling Doctrines nyo, binabasa lang ng mga INC.

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    3. Kanino ba galing ang Biblia na sinasabi mong "nagsalita"?

      O baka di mo alam.. tutulungan kita.

      Ang IGLESIA KATOLIKA ang nangusap kung ALING AKLAT ang nasa-loob ng BIBLIA na hawak mo.

      Kami ang naglagay ng mga Chapters niyan, baka di mo alam... kaya't KAMI ang nagsalita sa inyo na kayong mga MANLILINLANG!

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    4. Maling doctrines? Really? Have you evaluated our Catholic doctrines? Oh c'mon, lost sheep of Iglesia ni Manalo. Do you really think you are on the so-called One and True Church?
      Wake up, you hypocrites! You may be teaching the word of God but you don't have the authority and infallibility to do so because your church DOES NOT HAVE EVEN ONE!
      If I were on a blank slate, I'd rather choose "Iglesia ni Cristo" of 33 AD than "Iglesia ni Manalo" of 1915, which is way beyond the words of Christ to Peter in the gospel.
      We Catholics know our Bible 'cause that book is even part of our Tradition. When speaking a verse, we just don't know where to flip the pages. We just know what we say it also says because it is OUR Bible. The Catholic Church is the Mother of the Bible.
      And one thing, Jesus left us a Church, not a book. And the Church then bore a book, and named it Bible.

      Technically, we Catholics know our faith. Now if ever you INM accused us for any alleged acts that your bible opposes, then what you did already opposes what OUR BIBLE says about it like DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESSES. You told others, you preached your people, that the Catholic Church is the pagan evil Church. Well, well, look who's been putting others down. Is that what a good Christian must do to his fellow Christians? Hahahaha.

      Just accept the fact that all your church does is to make false testimonies and destroy the Church that was founded by the One whom you named after your church. Ang kakapal ng mukha bwahahahaha. Some of you even shouted ALLELUIA while they accused and dirty-mouthed the Catholic Church. Woah. Again, you are violating one of the 10 commandments which is DO NOT USE THE NAME OF THE LORD IN VAIN. Bwahaha.

      It's just so funny to see how they falsely attack without even a sense of logic or deeper understanding or whatsoever. Thanks INM for making me laugh!

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    5. Maling doctrines? Really? Have you evaluated our Catholic doctrines? Oh c'mon, lost sheep of Iglesia ni Manalo. Do you really think you are on the so-called One and True Church?
      Wake up, you hypocrites! You may be teaching the word of God but you don't have the authority and infallibility to do so because your church DOES NOT HAVE EVEN ONE!
      If I were on a blank slate, I'd rather choose "Iglesia ni Cristo" of 33 AD than "Iglesia ni Manalo" of 1915, which is way beyond the words of Christ to Peter in the gospel.
      We Catholics know our Bible 'cause that book is even part of our Tradition. When speaking a verse, we just don't know where to flip the pages. We just know what we say it also says because it is OUR Bible. The Catholic Church is the Mother of the Bible.
      And one thing, Jesus left us a Church, not a book. And the Church then bore a book, and named it Bible.

      Technically, we Catholics know our faith. Now if ever you INM accused us for any alleged acts that your bible opposes, then what you did already opposes what OUR BIBLE says about it like DO NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESSES. You told others, you preached your people, that the Catholic Church is the pagan evil Church. Well, well, look who's been putting others down. Is that what a good Christian must do to his fellow Christians? Hahahaha.

      Just accept the fact that all your church does is to make false testimonies and destroy the Church that was founded by the One whom you named after your church. Ang kakapal ng mukha bwahahahaha. Some of you even shouted ALLELUIA while they accused and dirty-mouthed the Catholic Church. Woah. Again, you are violating one of the 10 commandments which is DO NOT USE THE NAME OF THE LORD IN VAIN. Bwahaha.

      It's just so funny to see how they falsely attack without even a sense of logic or deeper understanding or whatsoever. Thanks INM for making me laugh!

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    6. lol all Iglesia ni Cristo Did was Miss using the Bible, Reading it and interpreting it in out of Context! you use your own interpretation not the real interpretation of the Holy Bible. Just like what Ventelacion did when he would Quote works of Catholic Priests, he would Use the Books that the Priest had Written then IGNORE all the IDEAS of the Priests and Implant his own interpretation of the BOOK!

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  5. teka bat ba tayo laging naasar sa iglesia ni Cristo..?

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    Replies
    1. Teka, bakit sila INIS na INIS sa mga KATOLIKO at sa IGLESIA KATOLIKA? Yan ang dapat mo munang itanong sa sarili mo.

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    2. Hindi naman kami naiinis sa Catholic,naawa nga kami sa inyo,dahil gusto namin na maalis kayo jan sa maling paniniwala.Hindi po yan ang tunay na iglesia na kay Cristo.

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    3. Venz,

      Alam mo, bago pa lamang itatag ng inyong pekeng sugo ang kanyang INCorporated eh iyon naman ang kanyang layunin eh. Dahil naniniwala siyang ang IGLESIA KATOLIKA ay TUNAY na IGLESIA NI CRISTO pero “natalikod” daw kaya ang role niya ay ang “i-RESTORE” daw po ito in its pristine beauty.

      Weee di nga!

      Heto’t namatay na at kalansay na lamang ang iniwan ng inyong pekeng sugo kasama ng kanyang anak na si Eraño pero NAMAMAYAGPAG pa rin ang IGLESIA KATOLIKA na sa PASIMULA’y siyang TUNAY na IGLESIA NI CRISTO ayon sa PASUGO Abril 1966, p. 46.

      Opo, ang IGLESIA KATOLIKA po ay TUNAY na Iglesia ni Cristo ayon ulit sa inyong PASUGO Abril 1966, p. 46!

      Kaya’t bakit naman kami AALIS sa IGLESIANG tunay na kay CRISTO?!

      PASUGO Mayo 1968, p. 7:
      “Ang tunay na Iglesia ni Cristo ay iisa lamang, ito ang Iglesiang itinayo ni Cristo. Kung mayroon mang nagsisibangon ngayong mga Iglesia at sasabihing sila man ay INK rin ang mga ito ay hindi tunay kundi huwad lamang!"

      Bakit, kailan ba naitatag ang INC? Noong July 27, 1914..

      Kayo ang dapat umalis sa PEKENG INC

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    4. Mas nakakaawa kayong mga member ng inm dahil hindi nyo pinaniniwalang DIYOS si CHRIST. Yan ang pinakamalaking kasalanan nyo sa DIYOS. Nakakakilabot kayo!!

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    5. Mas nakakaawa kayong mga taga inm dahil hindi nyo pinaniniwalang DIYOS si KRISTO. Yan ang pinakamalaking kasalanan nyo. Nakakapangilabot yung maling paniniwala nyo yaikks!!

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  6. marami akong kilalang inc mababait sila,bilib ako sa pagsunod nila sa inuutos ng admistrasyon nila. nakaka awa nga lamang sila. satuwing inaaproach ko ang isang kaibigan ko na inc ang lagi na lang nila sinasabi sa akin ay dumalo daw ako sa padoctrina nila.sumisitas ako ng ilang talata galing sa biblia na kahit na elementary ay maiintindihan, pero para sa kanila ang administrasyon lamang nila ang tama kahit na malinaw na itong nakasulat sa biblia, nakakaawa sila talaga,wala silang kalayaan, ang nanaaig sa kanila ay takot,takot sa sasabihin ng magulang dahil sa kahihiyan,takot sa mga nakagisnang kaibigan takot na baka sila ay itakwil.nakakaawa sila dahil sa pag dating ng paghuhukom hindi nila maaring tawagin ang mga ministro nila o ang administrasyon nila para magpaliwanag sa Panginoon.mahalin natin ang mga INC upang makagawa ang Banal na Espirito sa pamamagitan natin. kamuhian natin ang mga nagtuturo sa kanila ng maling aral. hindi mananaig ang Banal na Spirito sa pagawa kung puro batikos lang ang gagawin natin. magmumukha lamang tayong mga impokrito..

    1 John 4:13 This is how we know that we live in him and he in us: He has given us of his Spirit. 14And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world. 15If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God. 16And so we know and rely on the love God has for us.

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  7. Here is my take on this. If you can answer me with some sort of sense, my family and I will join the INC.
    While driving along Turbina in Calamba, I saw a person on the street with his face completely destroyed. I said to myself, what did this person do to deserve this. The following day, I went back to the same place and asked questions among the bystanders there. The story is this, there was a hit and run involving another person (female). The guy I mentioned rushed to the person who got hit because her bodylay in the middle of the street. He was able to throw her body at the side of the street a second before a bus hit him.
    Know, if based on INC teaching, this guy will not go to heaven because he is not a member of INC. If you're telling me that no one outside INC will be saved by the father who created regardless of how good he lived, would that be right? If you have a son or a daughter, would that be your basis in granting forgiveness/salvation? I admire the INC because of their discipline and unity. But I just can't find it in me to hate the faith of others. To think that I am better because of my faith. To believe that I will be saved and the people around me will not. Would that make Him worthy of my worship? Answer me with some sort of sense and I will join your faith. Do not give me the "Noah" crap. I've heard it before and I am not convinced. We do not live in such an evil world as what is described in the story of Noah. Answer me and and will lose the impression that your organization only grew because you do not allow your members to be married to member of other faiths. Thank you.

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    Replies
    1. And correct me I'm wrong. Ang sabi ng kanilang katuruan ay ang HINDI BINYAGAN sa INC ay hindi maliligtas.

      Si Felix Manalo ay HINDI nabinyagan sa kanyang INC, ibig ba nilang sabihin ay sila mismo ang nagpapatunay na si Felix Manalo ay HINDI NALIGTAS sa kanyang pagka-SUGO sapagkat di man lang siya nabinyagan!

      At kung ang kanilang SUGO ay hindi naligtas, anong garantiya nila na SILA ya MALILIGTAS?

      Hokus Pokus kasi ang mga turo na gawa ng tao! Kaya wala silang sairiling bait.

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    2. Sa term nio pa lang ay mali na Cath Def.Walang binyag sa INC kundi bautismo.Iba ang baustismo sa sinasabi ninyong binyag.Kung ang tintukoy nio ay bautismo,lahat naman kayong nasa Catholic ay hindi nabautismuhan dahil wala naman pong ganun sa inyo.Binyag meron pero hindi bautismo.HIndi talaga kayo maliligtas niyan.

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    3. Venz,

      Tanghaling tapat nagbibilad ka ng kabobohan. Ang binyag ba at ang bautismo ay magkaiba?

      Tingnan natin online Tagalog-English Dictionary:

      binyag
      biny´ag n. baptism • magbiny´a, binyag´an (mag-:-an) v. to baptize someone. Nagbinyag ng mga bata ang pari kahapon. The priest baptized the children yesterday.

      Ayon pala eh!

      Ang BINYAG pala ay TAGALOG ng BAPTISM at ang BAUTISMO ay SPANISH ito, at hindi tagalog!

      So sinong lalabas na HINDI nabautismuhan?

      Kami ang ORIGINAL na nabautismuhan.

      TAKE NOTE si FELIX MANALO ay HINDI na-BAUTISMUHAN sa loob ng INC at tanging ang kanyang BAUTISMO (BINYAG) as Iglesia Katolika ang NAGBIGAY sa kanya ng OFFICIAL name niyang FELIX!

      At kung ang bautismo lang pala ang paraan ng pagliligtas IKAW na rin ang nagsabing HINDI MALILIGTAS si Felix na inyong pekeng sugo dahil HINDI SIYA NABAUTISMUHAN o NABINYAGAN sa kanyang tatag na INC!

      Hungkag!

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    4. Ang bautismo ay inilulubog ang babautismuhan. Sa inyo po kc buhos,,magkapareha ba yun?Magkaiba di ba?Sa pangalan at sa paraan magkakaiba di ba Catholic Defender?Ano ba ang tamang paraan ng bautismo?Tulad ba ng wisik at buhos na isinasagawa ng IKAR?Pakisagot nga po..

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    5. Nilulublob ba?

      Bakit, nariyan ka ba nung unang ginagap ang bautismo? O naron ba ang inyong pastor noong unang Iglesia?

      Malabo!

      Eh nung panahon ng Pentecost, may halos 3,000 ang nagpabinyag, tanong ko sa yo, MAY SAPAT BANG TUBIG ILOG ang JERUSALEM para sa bautismo?

      Mangangamatis ka sa paghahanap ng ilog sa Jerusalem.

      Kaya bago ka MAGBILAD ng KAMANGMANGAN, balikan mo ang iyong mga BAYARANG MINISTRO, tanong mo kung anong EXPERTISE ang meron siya pagdating sa Biblia.

      Ni BIBLE SCHOLAR nga eh WALA KAYO?

      Eh Bible nga eh NAKIKIHIRAM lang kayo sa mga KATOLIKO at mga PROTESTANTE na binansagan ni FELIX MANALO ng mga kampon noi Satanas...


      Isaac na bobo, bumalik ka sa templo niyo at dun kayo MAGBOLAHAN, isama mo ang inyong PEKENG sugo!

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  8. "Jesus Christ Died for All Humanity" hindi lang para sa INC.... Kung kayo lang ililigtas ng diyos, Ang sama naming diyos yan...
    we should Love and Forgive EVERYONE because God Loves EVERYBODY.. Yan ang turo samin Bilang mga KATOLIKO...

    Kelan lang ba tinatag ang INC.. diba mga 1910 lang or what...ehh kalian ba pinako si cristo, namatay inilibing, nabuhay at umakyat sa langit... almost 2000 years ago na... ano yan.. na late ng pag tatag ng totoong simbahan si Cristo..?? pano yung mga namatay na befor na Hindi man lang nabinyagan sa INC kasi late na nga naitatag ang INC... Impyerno lahat yun??? ang weird naman ng Turo ninyo....

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  9. @Sir Isaac Newton, Think ng maayos Sir hah!, ang argumento po ni sir Venz wala daw Bautismo sa Catoliko kundi Binyag lang, ngayon lumalabas na itong si Sir Venz hindi alam ang sinasabi nya kawawa naman siya saan ba nag-aral ang taong ito at hindi alam na ang "Binyag" at "Bautismo" na sinasabi nya ay pareho...paanong walang bautismo sa katoliko tapos sabi nya binyag lang at magkaiba daw yon..(maaring sa pamamaraan) pero yong Terminology ay pareho ng meaning.. di ba contradicting yong sinasabi nya. ngayon paano nyo masasabi na TOTOO yang mga ipinangaral sa inyo ng mga MINISTRO nyo eh sa "Binyag" at "Bautismo" nlang hindi nyo alam ang kahulugan (see CATDEF definition). maraming salamat sa pagpapatunay na NILINLANG lang talaga kayo ng mga MINISTRO nyo... nakakatakot!!! LIGTAS BA KAMO KAYO? isip isip din sir hah may time pa!

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    Replies
    1. Lublob daw ang katanggap-tanggap na bautismo. Na-LUBLOB ba si Felix Manalo sa kanyang tatag na INC? Ni WISIK nga lang wala. In other words, HINDI NABAUTISMUHAN SI FELIX MANALO SA LOOB NG IGLESIA NI CRISTO-1914!

      At kung WALA raw SAYSAY ang "binyag" o BAUTISMO ni Felix Manalo na kanilang sugo sa loob ng Iglesia Katolika, eh bakit hanggang ngayon GAMIT pa rin ang FELIX bilang kanyang OFFICIAL NAME na ang IGLESIA KATOLIKA ang NAGBIGAY sa kanya nito noong SIYA AY BINYAGAN (o Bautismuhan)?

      Nauuntog na ang mga INC ni Manalo sa katotohanan pero ayaw pang aminin! Sa ka-DILIMAN nga naman sila nakatira!

      Delete
  10. C JESUS I ANG PANGINOON NA NAG KATAWAN TAO...AT CXIA ANG ISINUGO
    DITO SA KA LUPAAN.


    CXIA I NAGING PANTUBOS SA ATING KASALANAN !!!


    AT CXIA DIN I NAGING PASTOR
    NA NDI HUMINGI NG ANUMANG BAYAD
    SA KANYANG MGA TINURUAN SA MGA LITANYA NG PANGINOON !!



    AT C FELIX MANALO?
    CXIA I NANGARAL SAPAGKAT DATAPWAT
    I HUMINGI CXIA ...SA MGA NATUTURUAN NYA.... "IKAPO"



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  11. KUNG SINASAVI NG MGA I.N.C NA MALILIGTAS SILA SA MGA HULING ARAW?



    TRY NYO NA SA ACTUAL






    SAKYAN NYO UNG BIBLIYA NYO
    SA GITNA NG DAGAT...


    AT SA CATHOLIC I KAHOY NA CRUZ NI JESUS !!!




    SINO LULUBOG AT LULUTANG?


    ReplyDelete

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